Meph, Andy, Pindleskin (most of the time), Council (majority of them), Summoner, Fire Eye, Ancient Tunnels.
While this is great for starting out, I'm really wanting to add more targets into my runs; specifically the Countess, Nihlathak, Diablo or Baal. I've looked at the various guides but didn't see a clear path. These are the 2 top options as I can see them, with my questions about them:
Blizzballer -- No lightning means merc has to kill the Countess; how much +skills for this to be really strong?
Infinity CL/Lightning -- Supposedly this is extremely expensive, but exactly how much would this cost to be effective?
As far as wealth goes, I've currently got about Vex + 2xIst in pure rune value, and potentially a few HRs worth of item value if I could find buyers for my expensive stuff. And I also have a 4os Eth CA. So I could probably scrape together a nice Infinity, and afford 1 Sorc Torch, but I doubt I could buy many Lightning GCs after that.
Right now I'm doing 5250 min Blizz damage with like -155 ECR. I would want to be able to at least get close to that level of kill power if I switch to a new build. I have no STorch, but I do have 1 Anni and 2 cold GC's, and currently run Shako/Skullders/Oculus/Arach/max-block Mosers. I plan to get the STorch for a new build, and I guess I could switch to Tal's & Spirit if that would be helpful. (actually I just went ahead and rolled a 35 Spirit.)
Advice appreciated, thanks!|||As far as CL/Lightning, the costs of making this effective are basically:- Infinity rune word (ber mal ber ist)
- Griffon's Eye Diadem
- Sorc Torch
Total cost: 3+ HR's (depending on the stats of the Griffons + STorch)
After that, you just basically need gear that puts you into the 117% fcr break point with good resists.
I believe hitting the 117% fcr break point is really important, so if you opt to use Tal's set + 35% fcr spirit, you'd have to either get a 2/20 ammy, or get two 10% fcr rings (assuming you don't already use two 10% fcr rings already) if you wanted to go CL/Lightning.
From my own experiences, if you are mostly concerned about speed, then pure lightning paired with infinity would definitely be the fastest, the only downside would be the cost + your MF% would most likely take a significant drop.|||Quote:
As far as CL/Lightning, the costs of making this effective are basically:
- Infinity rune word (ber mal ber ist)
- Griffon's Eye Diadem
- Sorc Torch
Total cost: 3+ HR's (depending on the stats of the Griffons + STorch)
Well, is that Infinity on the merc or on you? I've seen both in guides. If on the merc, does it need other expensive gear to stay alive?
As for the cost, I think I want Infinity regardless. Seems like it would help a Blizzballer a lot too. One thing is I do already have 2 cold skillers plus a FCR cold ammy. Have you tried Blizzballer as well, for comparison? I was leaning toward trying that after my OP.
|||Infinity/Lightning puts anything else you could do to shame. If you can't afford one right now I'd stick to blizz for a bit, as I think a dual-tree build is going to be a step down for you.Once you scrape together Infinity you're pretty much sorted. Griff's is ideal but not necessary, you can use Crescent Moon for -ELR. Alternatively Tal's with -5 facets will work well. IMO 117 FCR is nice but not a main goal. It's not hard to reach when using full Tal's and ridiculously easy on a Griff's build.
edit: Self-wielding Infi isn't a terrific idea, and it's a damn nice merc weapon besides. All he needs is some life leech and resists, Smoke and Tal's mask will do.|||Quote:
Well, is that Infinity on the merc or on you? I've seen both in guides. If on the merc, does it need other expensive gear to stay alive?
As for the cost, I think I want Infinity regardless. Seems like it would help a Blizzballer a lot too. One thing is I do already have 2 cold skillers plus a FCR cold ammy. Have you tried Blizzballer as well, for comparison? I was leaning toward trying that after my OP.
I haven't tried Blizzballer, I've used the FO/FB (Socialism's "orb-it-aller") for this ladder, so I can't give a comparison directly for a blizzballer.
Regarding the merc gear, I think regardless of if your merc wields infinity or not, you would want these two things for your merc:
-Life leech
-Damage reduction
The gear selection for your merc does not have to be expensive - your merc will do fine with a vamp gaze and a gladiators bane, treachery runeword, shaftstop, etc.
My merc uses infinity, vamp gaze (7% LL and 17% damage reduction), and an eth. fortitude. I very rarely ever have to use potions on him.
From my own personal experience, I have tried both a sorc wielding infinity and a sorc with the merc wielding infinity. There's a sticky that crunches the numbers for infinity on sorc vs. infinity on merc. If I remember correctly, the numbers were pretty close (basically negligible) so it comes down to personal preference.
Here are the immediate pros/cons that I can think of off the top of my head:
Pro of using infinity on your sorc:
- consistency - by consistency, I mean those moments where you tele near a mob, then your merc walks to some area where there are no monsters. You can see that the fundamental problem lies within the system which does not allow you to truly micro your merc. You can amend this by teleporting closer to the mob to reposition your merc though.
- takes advantage of the inherent -45% to -55% ELR property of the infinity rune word
- Saves a lot of stat points being pumped into strength since you won't be using a shield (normally, a Spirit monarch)
- Allows your merc to wield the Insight runeword, or any other weapon of your choice
Cons:
- Lack of resists via use of shield and weapon
- Lack of +Skills via shield and weapon
- Lack of creativity with choice of weapon (although using a wep/shield combo isn't exactly choosing from a wide selection, it's still more than being forced to use 1 weapon without the flexibility to switch around your wep/shield slots)
The pros/cons for using the infinity on your merc would basically be a reverse of the previously mentioned pro/cons.
Basically, you need to ask yourself if you are comfortable with losing the foregone stats of using a wep/shield vs. the consistency of infinity being held on your self. Is the opportunity cost worth it, to you, to wield infinity yourself? Or do you prefer having the stats and properties granted from wielding your choice of weapon/shield?
With that said, in my opinion, I think you would want the infinity on your merc - it's a good weapon for him anyways. I opted for this route because I like what I can gain via weapon + shield slots being used, vs. just the weapon slot.
Hope that helps a bit.|||Some good info, thanks. I saw someone on the Blizzballer thread (I think) saying they had almost 4k damage on their Blizzard with a torch but without any skillers. I was trying to figure out how that was possible since I they only had one of the three synergies maxed. If I could get 4k Blizzard as well as a strong Fireball, that seems pretty good.
About the Infinity helping cold -- it would still help in the sense that you'd need less points in CM -- maybe just 1 hardpoint + skills + infinity would be enough. It's a tough choice between them, I dunno. Most of you here seem to say go with lightning. Either way I want the Infinity though.
Also, yesterday I found a +14% Lightning damage, +3 Chain Lightning Ormus with high def. Would I want to use that with a infinity lightning sorc who is MFing? I dunno how much you use CL and how much you use plain Lightning, and how it would fit into an overall set of equipment, vs. something like partial Tal's or full Tal's. As for losing some magic find, that isn't that big of a deal... I understand the diminishing returns on it, although I may have to spend more wealth improving my MFSC's if I wasn't relying on Shako/Skullders.
To reach 117% with uniques, I was thinking maybe 35 Spirit + 30 Oculus + 20 Arach + 20 Magefist + 10 Ring + 10 Amulet, giving me the option to have a Nature's Peace for Nihlathak. Or if I include 20 on Ormus that's even easier. If I do Tals it seems a lot harder to reach that FCR. And with full Tals I can't think of a way to reach it unless I use 2x10 FCR ring and Magefist.
** I also forgot to mention I have a +3 Lightning Skills, 20 FCR Tiara someone traded me a while ago. Not exactly a Griffon's, but would this be worth socketing with some -5/+4 Facets in the meantime, if I go with a lightning sorc? Or don't even bother and just wait for Griffon's?
** Nevermind, just socketed it, got one socket and then sold it in disgust. :P|||Regarding infinity helping out on cold - if I recall correctly, your cold mastery would only work if infinity actually broke the cold immunity.
If you don't have infinity yet, then I think going with a blizzballer would be just fine until you farm up your infinity.
Concerning the Ormus' robe; personally, I wouldn't use it. I think an upped vipermagi is better. But you also want to MF with this sorc, so I think going with 3 piece Tals is probably the best compromise if you are going pure lightning - I agree hitting 117% is pretty tough with full Tals, I think you give up a lot to achieve it if you were to use full Tals.
Assuming you were to go pure lightning:
First, lets count your FCR:
Occy - 30
Tiara (or Shako) - 20 (or 0)
Tal Ammy - 0
Shield (Spirit) - 35
Tal Armor - 10 (From bonus)
Tal Belt - 10 (From bonus)
Magefists - 20
Total: 125% FCR/105% with Shako.
Regarding that tiara, I think it's a pretty nice placeholder for a Griffons. I'm not sure if I would use a socket quest on that though, I'm looking at it mainly because of the 20% FCR it's giving you - this lets you free up your ammy slot for the Tals ammy, and it also lets you use 2 rings of your choice (ideally 2 SoJ's, or 1 SoJ + 1 Nature's Peace for Nihlathak).
Opportunity cost:
-Using Shako, you get +2 skills, life, mana, 10% DR, and 50% MF. To reach 117%, you need two 10% FCR rings. (If using 3 Piece Tals)
-The 2 rings would ideally have other mods, such as resists, etc. but this set up will not allow you to have +skills on your ring slots, plus it won't let you use your Nature's Peace.
-Using the Tiara, you get +3 Lightning skills, and 20% FCR, and I'm guessing some other mods.
-Now since you have FCR covered, you can basically put 2 SoJ's on, giving you an additional +2 skills, and +50% Max mana, or instead of 2 SoJ's, you can put on that Nature's Peace + 1 SoJ - I favor the flexibility the Tiara gives you; by forgoing the benefits of a Shako, you replace those benefits with the Tiara + 2 rings of your choice.
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